What if the secret to scaling your business isn't just about
strategy and systems — but about the people you surround yourself
with? In this episode of The Grown Up Business Podcast, Paul Avins
is joined by Terry Fisher — serial entrepreneur, angel investor,
and former CEO who has built and sold five businesses, navigated
both spectacular successes and devastating failures, and learned
how to leverage the power of networks to create extraordinary
outcomes. Terry shares his remarkable journey from starting his
first business at 18 to running Thomas Cook, nearly buying it for
£500 million, and selling a music app to Snapchat for over $100
million in just 18 months. Along the way, he opens up about the
dark period after his first business failure, why taking on outside
investors can be a double-edged sword, and how surrounding himself
with the right people — from supportive partners to strategic
co-investors — became the key to his biggest wins. Together, Paul
and Terry unpack why knowing your exit matters from day one, how
preemption clauses keep partnerships honest, why gut instinct beats
spreadsheets when choosing who to back, and how building genuine
relationships unlocks doors that money and strategy alone never
could. This episode is essential listening for founders and CEOs
who want to scale faster by building smarter networks, choosing the
right partners, and understanding that success is rarely a solo
journey. Key Takeaways Why surrounding yourself with the right
people is more valuable than any business plan How Terry nearly
bought Thomas Cook for £500 million — and why the board said no The
first time Terry took on outside investors — and why it led to his
first business failure Why preemption clauses in shareholder
agreements keep everyone honest and protect value How a music app
went from struggling to raise money at a $5M valuation to selling
for over $100M to Snapchat Why knowing your exit from day one
changes every decision you make in your business How gut instinct
and meeting the people behind the pitch drives Terry's angel
investment decisions The importance of getting back on the horse
after failure — and why the journey matters more than the
destination About the Guest Terry Fisher is a serial entrepreneur,
angel investor, and former CEO with over 30 years of experience
building, scaling, and exiting businesses. He has built and sold
five companies, served on the board of Thomas Cook, and invested in
multiple startups across tech, music, energy, and finance. Terry
specializes in helping entrepreneurs scale through strategic
networks, smart partnerships, and disciplined execution. He splits
his time between London and California, mentoring founders and
backing the next generation of high-growth businesses. Next Steps
Apply it now Identify one area where the right connection or
partnership could unlock your next level of growth — and take
action to build that relationship. Connect with Terry Fisher Follow
Terry on LinkedIn and Instagram for insights on entrepreneurship,
investing, and scaling businesses. Scale with Paul If this episode
resonated, Paul's work focuses on helping founders step out of the
day-to-day and scale with structure and confidence. Book a call
with Paul: https://www.paulavins.com/book-a-call Subscribe to the
Scale-Up Newsletter: https://www.paulavins.com/newsletter-opt-in
About Paul Avins Paul Avins is a scale-up business coach and
founder of the Grown-Up Business framework. He works with founders
and CEOs to help them move from operator to scale-up leader —
building businesses that grow sustainably, scale beyond the
founder, and create real enterprise value. Paul's work focuses on
disciplined leadership, high-performing teams, and systems that
replace chaos with clarity. Level Up. Team Up. Scale Up. Fire Up.
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